Need some advice on possible setup

[N@Z 0]

I was under the impression that what red_ryder actually wanted was to be able to use the Cayin for headphone listening whereas the speakers are powered using the Cayin as the pre-amp & the Receiver as the power amp because the Cayin is not able to drive the speakers efficiently. Hence:

CDP->Cayin->Receiver->Speakers

[red_ryder 0]

That's exactly what I want N@z. But since my receiver does not have any pre-in inputs, Mackie says that connecting the cayin to the receiver via the regular line-ins may be risky. I guess my receiver is not capable of being a power amp.

Edited August 5, 2004 by red_ryder

[lekguan 0]

I was wondering if you connect the cayin to receiver, wouldn't the cayin act like a variable gain control, and if you turn it low enough, and adjust volume from receiver, it should not be dangerous right?

Edited August 5, 2004 by lekguan

[N@Z 0]

Doing it the way Mackie suggested will allow you to use the CDP for both amps but I thought the whole exercise was to make the sound of your speakers more tubey. As I've mentioned, if it is available, you can use your "TAPE-IN" or "AUX" (auxillary, CD or Tuner) input on the receiver for that purpose without risking harm because the output from the Cayin cannot be varied until it is amplified by you receiver. Note I am referring to the Cayin's "line-out" & not speaker outputs & make sure the "PRE INPUT" switch is in the off position otherwise it will become a variable gain control like lekguan mentioned.

[Mackie 0]

From my understanding, I read that first priority is to maintain a connection which allows cdp to be played through Cayin and receiver without having to switch cables. Utilizing Cayin as a pre-amp is secondary unless the receiver can function as a standalone power amp.

[Mackie 0]

I was wondering if you connect the cayin to receiver, wouldn't the cayin act like a variable gain control, and if you turn it low enough, and adjust volume from receiver, it should not be dangerous right?

Agree..........much akin to setting a subwoofer volume to a fixed level and all necessary adjustment thru the receiver's subwoofer volume. However, there's a risk - someone could unintentionally moved the sub's volume pot and this would throw the overall balance into disarray or even result in blown drivers.

[Mackie 0]

make sure the "PRE INPUT" switch is in the off position otherwise it will become a variable gain control like lekguan mentioned.

 

Good one! I've forgotten about the Cayin's flip switch at the front panel. If gain control of Cayin can be defeated and signal from cdp > Cayin is routed out from its Pre-out at the same level, then it's feasible to connect Cayin Pre-out to any of selector input (except phono) on the receiver.

 

Redryder: I suggest U try both configurations but make sure volume pot on Cayin is set to minimum.

 

N@Z: Does this flip switch affect the Cayin's function as a head amp? If so, the user will have to ensure the switch is in the right position whenever he chooses to use either his cans or receiver.

Edited August 6, 2004 by Mackie

[N@Z 0]

N@Z: Does this flip switch affect the Cayin's function as a head amp? If so, the user will have to ensure the switch is in the right position whenever he chooses to use either his cans or receiver.

I've never tried, maybe arj can enlightened us since he has used both & uses the Cayin mostly as a Preamp on his setup.

[arj 0]

The front flip switch is only for switching the cayin from either as head-amp or pre-amp. if cayin is use for pre-amp the the it must be switch to 'on' position.

 

 

[arj 0]

Red Ryder:

 

Have you try my suggestion. or your receiver can not be made like as 'power amp' is it?.

[Mackie 0]

I own a Yamaha AX-2 AV amp and this was second from the top of flagship model in the previous series. Unless there's a change in Yammie's common designs, I don't think current receivers have facilities for bridging or pre-power disintegration.

 

Here's my summarized deduction. U can't work the receiver as a standalone power amp. Cayin may be able to provide a bypassed line output (RCA input/output stage) to receiver's line input but not as a fixed gain pre-amp. Hence, the receiver will never be able to take on the Cayin's tube signatures. However, the cdp can be linked to the two amps without having to switch interconnects.

[red_ryder 0]

Ok, I've tried out N@z and arj's configuration - namely cdp --> cayin --> receiver. The sound coming out from the speakers was quite bad, very muffled. I had to turn the volume on the Cayin up to the 12 oclock position and the volume on the receiver to 10 oclock position just to hear something. This is with the Cayin's pre-amp switch at the "on" position. If I switch to "off", I don't get any sound at all no matter how high the volume control is turned up.

 

In comparison, if the cdp is connected directly to the receiver, the volume knob on the receiver need only be turned to 8 oclock position for a reasonable listening volume. And the sound quality improved tremendously compared to Cayin pre-amp configuration.

 

 

[Goondu 0]

Have you tried connecting the cdp -> receiver -> Cayin ( via Tape out)?

How's the sound on the cans using this?

If this connection produces sound not satisfactory to your liking, a split RCA or split box might be your only choice. Another benefit (as mentioned by someone ealier) is your receiver does not have to be turn on while listening on your cans. If you are worried about introducing extra signals into your pathway, go for the RCA split cable. You can DIY a RCA split cable quite cheaply with belden cables. You can try that first and see if it works and if you like the sound. You might be surprised.

I have not tried the split RCA cable before. Just a suggestion

Let us know how it goes

[Mackie 0]

What's the difference between that configuration vs cdp-->cayin-->receiver?

 

I will advocate this path if your receiver has pre-out/power-in facilities at the back panel. Since U don't have this, how are U gonna connect Cayin to your receiver? Through line-level selector inputs such as AUX/CD/Tape-in right? There's where risk will be prevalent since the signal fed from Cayin pre-amp stage carries variable gain pertaining to your adjustment on its volume control. Sound quality will also be compromised even if full gain from Cayin pre-out does not hurt your receiver's line-in circuitry. The reason is poorer signal/noise ratio.

 

My concern is thus proven. Signal/noise ratio will drop tremendously. Even if the volume pot on Cayin is maxed out, it's akin to connecting your portable amp to a pcdp headphone out instead of line out, thus, sound quality degradation.

 

This leaves red_ryder with the other option, cdp> receiver > receiver tape-out > cayin. However, I'm quite certain the receiver would have to be powered on albeit listening to headphones. Volume pot on receiver has no effect on the tape-out signal and thus, set to minimum.

Edited August 7, 2004 by Mackie

[arj 0]

This is very intriguing...

 

Hem.... your receiver cannot be use as stand-alone power-amp.

 

It seem to me that Red_ryder has the options suggested by Goondu and Mackie.