Kachui 0 Report post Posted March 10, 2009 Get this... http://www.lessloss.com/lessloss-firewall-...utor-p-196.html Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nofing 0 Report post Posted March 10, 2009 You gotta be kidding. I'm going to need a good firewall to protect myself against that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peanutbutterjam 0 Report post Posted March 10, 2009 (edited) Get this... http://www.lessloss.com/lessloss-firewall-...utor-p-196.html Hm this seems pretty exciting, and I hate to be a wet blanket, but I have my serious doubts. But before that, a disclaimer, I read that page, but I haven't had time to read the "read on" part. Glancing through, there seem to be some cartoons on that page, interspersed with graphs. And disclaimer 2: I'm tired. Ok to continue: The use of frequency dispersion correction via group velocity manipulation lends a natural sounding "illuminated" dynamic to the sound. I don't know. I'm no physics professor, but this seems to be complete bull to me. It sounds exactly like someone was trying to bluff his way through with technical jargon. Feel free to google "group velocity". Firstly, this implies that they have a really good idea how this "group velocity" affects sound presentation. At this moment, how a sound wave relate to presentation is still controversial at best, nobody can say for sure how to mathematically represent audio ideas like "clarity" or "dynamic" or "detailed". I.e. I'm saying that given a graph plot of a sound wave, nobody can really analyze how that will really sound with respect to these audio terms. Sure there are advances in digital audio technology, digital reproduction of space and imaging is getting better day by day, but till now these are still far off the radar of audiophile application. Is it because we are all mountain tortoises unwilling to give technology a go? Hardly. Very simply put, we are not anywhere near successfully scientifically analyzing a sound wave yet. So now, these ppl claim that the can give a "natural sounding "illuminated" dynamic" sound by manipulating the physics of a power supply. If nobody can even detail the effects of a audio signal on performance, I leave you to draw your own conclusions about power. [edited] Closure: Point is, if they had sold this product just saying "it sounds good", period, I might just buy that argument because I have yet to find a scientific argument why 2 power cords sound different. But using science to smoke through is a completely different thing altogether. They are claiming to know the answer to that question, and more. They are claiming to know how to manipulate these qualities to produce something approximating ideal. And reading their article doesn't seem to lead me to anything scientifically meaningful. Someone should open that box up and take an internal pic. That would be entirely fascinating. Edit: Ok, they seem to explain a little of that "frequency dispersion correction via group velocity management" later. Take fiber optics, for example. A fiber optic line creates a group velocity dispersion in the light frequency pulses that carry information. If this temporal group velocity dispersion is too large, a merging of the information-carrying pulse with adjacent pulses will occur, rendering errors in transmission. The most widely applied solution to this phenomenon is a mixing and matching of optical fibers with opposite sign dispersion characteristics, such that, in the end, the positive and negative dispersion qualities add up and cancel out. This is called dispersion compensation. Hm ok. I get what they are referring to. But that doesn't mean it is true. Negetive dispersion qualities? Correct me if I'm wrong but am I reading negative refractive index? That is currently used in optical fiber technology? Besides, do they know what kind of scale they are talking about? Speed of light varies at ratios of 10^-14 with respect to frequency. Speed of light itself is only 3x10^8. And the most obvious point, group velocity management in electrical power??? Materials with highly porous skin structures have extremely large surface areas. Just one gram of such material can have a surface area equal to half of a football field. So, a single DFPC may have an actual surface area the size of a large metropolis. Because they are traveling along the skin only, this is what the high frequencies see. The lower, desirable frequency, 50 or 60 Hz, sees the 6 feet from the wall to the gear and goes there directly, while the undesirable noise is getting lost in a vast cityscape. The low frequencies take the metro, the high frequencies have to walk. Firstly I don't buy the skin idea. While it IS true that STATIC electrical charge only resides on the surface of a perfect conductor, this is completely untrue for electrical current. Next, this whole idea of allowing the high frequencies to get "lost" just translates to me as this: a $5k high pass filter. Great. Edited March 10, 2009 by peanutbutterjam Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nofing 0 Report post Posted March 10, 2009 And there's my firewall! Many thanks PBJ. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Quantom 0 Report post Posted March 10, 2009 (edited) Pfft. If they wanted to even pass of at the least bit truthful, they would not have used such simplistic, unscientific pictures (or "data") to back up their grandiose claims. A mousetrap? A woman putting on makeup? Come on. Even stereophile has true-to-life scientific measurements of all its data on the last few pages, and it describes in painful detail each step taken. Another perfect example how marketing in audio was never to appeal to the ears, but more to the mind and its vivid imagination. Bravo. EDIT: Kinda reminds you of how cars are being advertised nowadays, ain't it? Edited March 10, 2009 by Quantom Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jojo_b2 0 Report post Posted March 10, 2009 Haha! Not to shoot down anything. Tweaks, amps, headphones and hi-fi sets can't be equated to price and you can even have a discussion of physics, electricity and the very nature of matter. But for a hobby it boils down to personal preference. Whatever it is as long as it "Works for YOU" and you feel happy. @Kachui James is really a good fellow. I just bought two 5ft cables for my speakers. I just had to clean the contacts and just plugged one to my Yamamoto. The sound difference is night and day compared to the stock cable. I like this than the Acrolink 4030 as the highs and mds are better articulated than the Acrolink. The bass isn't as deep and i feel it it might be a bit constrained as what my sonic memory tells me compared to the Sep's Blacksand. For the price he gave me this is a steal! Waiting for my Black sand to come in so I can use these babies on my speakers. lol! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Quantom 0 Report post Posted March 10, 2009 But for a hobby it boils down to personal preference. Whatever it is as long as it "Works for YOU" and you feel happy. Haha, more often than not, isn't this is the true essence of the flagrant exploitation that's taking place? Ok, enough rambling. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kachui 0 Report post Posted March 10, 2009 (edited) Wow...I was only joshing with Nofing when I gave him the link to the ridiculously priced power distributor...and no, I did not read through the page. My hats off to Peanutbutterjam for critically reading through it and giving us his thoughtful take on it. I guess to each is own is an appropriate comment here. I am no science student, and I don't even pretend to understand the science of sound and audio equipments. But I do trust my ears. Like many, when I came across articles on the internet and comments from fellow audio enthusiasts about the effects of power supply to the audio equipments, I was skeptical at best. A good friend of mine who owns a hifi shop (whose background, by the way is in electrical engineering), gave me a couple of power cords to try out on my rig without any obligations. I tried it out of curiosity, but in the back of my mind, I doubt it would do anything to my system. On top of that, I was hoping the audition of the cords would fail, because I did not want to be further poisoned and spend money on the rig. But unfortuantely I was blown away with the changes to the sound. I asked my friend, the audio shop owner, and former electrical engineer, to explain it in simple terms how the power cords could bring such improvement to the sound, but he said, as an engineer, all this sounds ridiculous on paper; it should not happen. But he said, it does, and he just does not know how to explain it. I guess for those of you who need scientific proof in order to believe that something actually works, then I say good for you; your money is safe from all the so called "snake oil" sellers. Okay...you can go ahead and "pfft pfft" me all you want...while I go back to enjoy my music. Edited March 10, 2009 by Kachui Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kidult 0 Report post Posted March 10, 2009 (edited) I guess for those of you who need scientific prove in order to believe that something actually works, then I say good for you; your money is safe from all the so called "snake oil" sellers. totally agree kachui Edited March 10, 2009 by kidult Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ical 0 Report post Posted March 10, 2009 (edited) The best way to stop being poison is to stop audition. Cos there's always better stuff out there no matter how you upgrade. Some might be just difference rather than improvement. You really have to know your preference or it'll be a never ending journey. Edited March 10, 2009 by ical Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
boon 0 Report post Posted March 11, 2009 Erm.. does that means some of u guys using normal power cord to extension plug? juz wondering... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jojo_b2 0 Report post Posted March 11, 2009 (edited) Erm.. does that means some of u guys using normal power cord to extension plug? juz wondering... Unfortyunately I'm one of those. I'm still using the stock chord from my Xindak Power distributor. I did some research and poking around. High Quality EU Plugs the one standard plugs in SG are much more expensive than the Audio Grade IEC plugs (US). Until I find one within my budget i will be staying on stock for a while. I also rent a flat and share it w/ relatives. So changing the sockets is not an option ATM. I must say the one Kachui got for the price he paid is a very good deal. Edited March 11, 2009 by jojo_b2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peanutbutterjam 0 Report post Posted March 11, 2009 (edited) I tried it out of curiosity, but in the back of my mind, I doubt it would do anything to my system. On top of that, I was hoping the audition of the cords would fail, because I did not want to be further poisoned and spend money on the rig. But unfortuantely I was blown away with the changes to the sound. I asked my friend, the audio shop owner, and former electrical engineer, to explain it in simple terms how the power cords could bring such improvement to the sound, but he said, as an engineer, all this sounds ridiculous on paper; it should not happen. But he said, it does, and he just does not know how to explain it. Totally agree. That's EXACTLY what happened with at Eric's. In all honesty I was rather hoping to hear nothing, so that those doubts can be put to rest once and for all. But I guess I visited the wrong person You really have to know your preference or it'll be a never ending journey. Completely agree. I've talked to this old guy before, can't rmb his name, but he was telling me how he "upgraded" all his stuff now and then. After a long while, he came across some component that he previously upgraded from and really liked it, and only then realized that he was going in a circle since it was his expectations going round. Easier said than done though. I've caught myself a few times guilty of that I also rent a flat and share it w/ relatives. So changing the sockets is not an option ATM. I'm quite a bit more lucky. I have a couple of wall sockets that are near my setup that I can use. But I was thinking, is no distributor better than a good distributor? If that's the case, I might as well forgo that and consider using the funds on the wall sockets themselves. Edited March 11, 2009 by peanutbutterjam Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kachui 0 Report post Posted March 12, 2009 It make sense, since there are wall sockets available, best to plug directly to them. Changing the wall sockets is the way to go for you, I guess. You may want to consider this, which is highly recommended in many hifi forums: http://www.oyaide.com/e_audio/audio_products_files/r1.html It is available in Adelphi. Cheaper than getting a good distributor and another power cord to connect it to the wall socket. But do some research on your own first before plunging into this. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
boon 0 Report post Posted March 12, 2009 Hey guys, I am wondering about Valgrind Audio, why is it that everyone so interested in that? Sorry for been too ignorant... Hehe... (I read up about Valgrind online but really wanted to hear from the owners too.) BTW< where to get it? & how muchie? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
